earlier sidewinder versions

[leonardo_c]

I'm really looking forward to the early 14A versions, thank you for all the work.

In this context, are we going to get also the earlier sidewinder versions? Right now the earliest we have is the Lima, it could be interesting to add support for D or G variants.

I'm asking because I like to play with coldwar settings pre 1980s and the Lima feels a bit too much. Other modules can use downgraded missiles but not the 14A.

[sLYFa]

AFAIK this is out of Heatblur's hands. ED's policy right now is that they want to have full control over the weapons in the game (which is understandable to some extent IMO). This means that for the F-14 or any other aircraft to be able to use D or G Sidewinders, ED would need to create them first. If and when this will happen is anyone's best guess.

[Schmidtfire]

4 hours ago, sLYFa said:

AFAIK this is out of Heatblur's hands. ED's policy right now is that they want to have full control over the weapons in the game (which is understandable to some extent IMO). This means that for the F-14 or any other aircraft to be able to use D or G Sidewinders, ED would need to create them first. If and when this will happen is anyone's best guess.

Iranians use/used AIM-9J and and perhaps the AIM-9P. Those missiles are already present in DCS (and on the F-4E), so they should be added on the early Tomcat. Other sidewinders might also be developed and implemented, since the F-100D is in progress and is in need of older winder variants. 

For a solution right now, it's very easy to add weapons and create custom loadouts.

[leonardo_c]

15 hours ago, Schmidtfire said:

Iranians use/used AIM-9J and and perhaps the AIM-9P. Those missiles are already present in DCS (and on the F-4E), so they should be added on the early Tomcat. Other sidewinders might also be developed and implemented, since the F-100D is in progress and is in need of older winder variants. 

For a solution right now, it's very easy to add weapons and create custom loadouts.

J and P would be ok indeed.

This workaround to avoid the limitations of not having the exact model will also be a factor when "one day" there wlll be a naval phantom.

[Tomcatter87]

I second the wish for more Sidewinder versions. For early 80s-stuff, we'd definitely need them. As a workaround for now, there's a nice mod. I'm not sure if it is compatible with the current DCS version, though. 

Iranian F-14 Weapons Pack (V1.2.8) 

[Schmidtfire]

Sidewinders aside. Iranians used AIM-7E (E-2?) on their Tomcat, so it should also be included for the early variant. 

Edited February 5 by Schmidtfire

[TLTeo]

20 hours ago, Schmidtfire said:

the F-100D is in progress and is in need of older winder variants. 

They would have no overlap with the Tomcat though - the older Navy variants it would have used are the D, G and H, while the Hun flew with the E.

[Schmidtfire]

49 minutes ago, TLTeo said:

They would have no overlap with the Tomcat though - the older Navy variants it would have used are the D, G and H, while the Hun flew with the E.

Ok  At least the Iranian loadout should be covered by pre-existing DCS assets. I'll guess we have to wait and see if any additional missiles will be modeled.

[Dragon1-1]

On 2/4/2025 at 5:39 PM, sLYFa said:

AFAIK this is out of Heatblur's hands. ED's policy right now is that they want to have full control over the weapons in the game (which is understandable to some extent IMO). This means that for the F-14 or any other aircraft to be able to use D or G Sidewinders, ED would need to create them first. If and when this will happen is anyone's best guess.

I don't think that it means that HB can't make a 3D model and configs for the older weapons, just that the ED will control the code after that. Several modules have otherwise unique weapons, I don't think ED is making them, just maintaining them.

[leonardo_c]

instead of going for the long solution and creating new missile variant, just go for the stopgap solution and add the loadouts with J and P.

those would be more than good enough and do not require any additional modelling, texturing, riveting and counting.

Edited February 6 by leonardo_c

[Stackup]

7 hours ago, leonardo_c said:

instead of going for the long solution and creating new missile variant, just go for the stopgap solution and add the loadouts with J and P.

those would be more than good enough and do not require any additional modelling, texturing, riveting and counting.

Except these missiles will be needed for future modules like the navy F-4, the A-7E from FlyingIron, and assuming they get to it, the F-8J from Mag3.  It's not just the F-14A that needs them. 

Heatblur has already made plenty of new weapons for their aircraft including the remodel of the AGM-45 and AIM-7E they made for ED to go with the F-4E along with all the other new weapons that came with it.  Personally, I disagree that the J and P should be used instead of adding an H model.  They're fine for the IRIAF Tomcat, but the US Navy didn't use those missiles and we should get at least one earlier one they did use.  I'd also include the AIM-7E-4 to this list as an earlier Sparrow variant that should be added for the F-14.

[Northstar98]

On 2/5/2025 at 3:38 PM, Tomcatter87 said:

I second the wish for more Sidewinder versions. For early 80s-stuff, we'd definitely need them.

Isn't the L already from the mid-to-late 70s and so is already the proper missile for early 80s stuff?

I mean the early F-14A is still a -135 from the mid 80s. The F-14A-95 will be Iranian though, so there the AIM-9J and AIM-7E-2 would be cool.

Of course the Tomcat could still use the AIM-9D, G and H, though not sure how applicable they'd be to 80s Tomcat missions (the H is from the early-mid 70s). They'd probably be more appropriate for the F-8 Crusader or Naval F-4 Phantom variant.

[Tomcatter87]

13 minutes ago, Northstar98 said:

Isn't the L already from the mid-to-late 70s and so is already the proper missile for early 80s stuff?

I mean the early F-14A is still a -135 from the mid 80s. The F-14A-95 will be Iranian though, so there the AIM-9J and AIM-7E-2 would be cool.

Of course the Tomcat could still use the AIM-9D, G and H, though not sure how applicable they'd be to 80s Tomcat missions (the H is from the early-mid 70s). They'd probably be more appropriate for the F-8 Crusader or Naval F-4 Phantom variant.

The L version might have been introduced in 1977, but I'm pretty sure other versions were still around for quite a few years. On this picture we can see a non-L variant on a Tomcat - as late as 1994. File:An AIM-9 Sidewinder missile is mounted onto an F-14A Tomcat aircraft during ordnance loading operations - DPLA - a5a0ec761c59983ceea2054446fc335e.jpeg - Wikimedia Commons

[Northstar98]

1 minute ago, Tomcatter87 said:

The L version might have been introduced in 1977, but I'm pretty sure other versions were still around for quite a few years. On this picture we can see a non-L variant on a Tomcat - as late as 1994. File:An AIM-9 Sidewinder missile is mounted onto an F-14A Tomcat aircraft during ordnance loading operations - DPLA - a5a0ec761c59983ceea2054446fc335e.jpeg - Wikimedia Commons

Interesting - I retract my previous statement.

[spikef22]

The AIM-9H would be very applicable for mid 70s missions, hope they make it happen one way or another!